MMO's New vs old

Was reading up on MMORPG.com and well came across an interesting read, lol, well came across the fourth part, so here all of it is minus pics:
This is also for those who need something to read/do while at work lol, i have skimmed some of it and it seems decently written other than typos.
http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/loadFeature/4547/page/1

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I first fell in love with the MMORPG genre at the tender age of eight. As I accompanied my parents to a local shopping mall, my life was changed forever. Through a crowded Electronic Boutique shop my eyes fixed upon a game; a piece of online, shapely ass. Like a star-crossed lover I had finally met the one, I knew things would never be the same again. Her box art told me her name was EverQuest. I clutched her to my chest and swore never to let go. But I was only eight years old and she was betrothed to SOE, what chance did we have in this crazy world?

If you are a long-standing veteran of the MMORPG genre, chances are you have a story like mine. For years I have pined for something to take my attention like EverQuest did in 1999; friends would tell me to move on, show me newer and more attractive MMORPGs. It didn’t work. Oh sure I have had a few flings here and there: a short-term relationship with World of Warcraft and a close call with Eve Online, but nothing has really come close to Norrath and its charms.

I wonder however, is my longing for a game such as EverQuest something born purely from nostalgia or simply that games made a decade previous were just better? Was there something truly magical captured within games such as: Ultima Online, EverQuest, Dark Age of Camelot and Anarchy Online? Or am I just a lonely almost-twenty-something that needs to open a window every so often? There’s only one way to find out…

In the ring this week is a Royal Rumble of gigantic proportions as games of past and present go head to head. Rip off your shirt in excitement, start screaming “Awooga!” in your most manly voice, and try to contain the tears of joy soon to be rolling down your cheeks. Let’s get ready to ruuuuuuuuuumble!

In the red corner

The MMORPG genre dated 1997-2003. An absolute golden age for online games whether your poison was Ultima Online, Asheron’s Call or Dark Age of Camelot. These were the games that made the jump from graphical MUD’s to fully 3D virtual worlds- Parents Basements and D&D nights were never quite the same again. Almost every genre convention was created within these years and to be quite honest, I don’t know if these Goliaths can be toppled. Break out your Voodoo 3 graphics card, have a Windows 98 disc at the ready, and set your Internet connections to dial-up. It’s about to get messy.

In the blue corner

The MMORPG genre dated 2004-Present. Who would have guessed that the words “goblin,” “elf,” and “epic” would not result in a feverish beating in the year 2010? MMORPGs are now so common place due to this generation of games that even Mr. T is getting in on the action. With progressive gameplay, new found accessibility, and numerous layers of shiny veneer, online role-play has never been so popular. Are they as good as the forefathers of the genre? Eleven million prepubescents can’t be wrong, can they?

Each category will be scored out of ten. In the name of non-biased opinions, both games will not be merited on current visuals and rose-tinted views will be kept to a minimum.

Game World

Back in the good old days, gaming worlds were, huge, massive, expansive and whoa-crap-yourself big. A trek through Norrath, Rubi-Ka or any other place would be a great undertaking. I remember personally clearing a Saturday night of activities as I attempted, with friends, to travel from Qeynos to Freeport. Developers seemed to take the term “virtual world” to heart and as such players were given the most vibrant and wonderful places to discover. Primitive by today’s standards but there was a real sense of exploration and excitement which seems lost on newer games. Players were literally given a sandbox full of wonderful creations to occupy themselves with. Game worlds were full with villages, towns and cities. These didn’t necessarily have any purpose beyond simply emulating a physical, fantasy world and this is something I miss from newer games.

Immersion was another factor that I feel really added to whole experience. Travel for instance, was undertaken without shortcuts; boat journeys could take up to forty minutes and up until Dark Age of Camelot, fast way-point traveling was just a glint in some developer’s eye. While I could grade the world design of older games perfect, I can see the negatives too. The lack of fast travel meant that a lot of game time was spent pressing “num lock” and dodging a few nasty looking bears. Also there seemed to be a general malice crafted into the game world as newbie zones would be often be littered with interestingly placed level 1,000 monsters. And nobody can forget the infamous Halloween raids of EverQuest where a thousand skeletal warriors rained down on beginner zones. The general ambition of the game worlds is admirable here, however, progressive mechanics such as fast travel is not entirely a bad thing. Almost perfect and the sheer scope should be something that has continued rather than replaced with the buzz word “refined”.9/10

Linear is the word that comes to mind when describing the worlds of newer games. The excitement and exploration possibilities of older games seem to have been replaced by funneling and hand guided paths. While this isn’t to my personal tastes, I can see what developers have done within this. Zones are now brimming with activities and possibilities. Take for instance the world of Azeroth; almost every zone has a purpose and progression through it and while this takes away a little wonderment, it makes for a better game. While the worlds are certainly smaller, there are infinitely more things to do and achieve, for instance cities are brimming with specific merchants and trainers rather than random NPC’s. In short, they have made a game rather than a playground.

Where newer MMORPG’s fail however is immersion. And by this I mean capturing a certain fantastical element. Every game I have played since 2004, has really failed to achieve that completely involved experience. While venturing throughout Middle Earth for instance, I am disappointingly aware that I am simply playing through a linear set of zones rather than a whole world. I think that is because of a mixture of fast travel and the scale of the worlds created. With fast travel options available there is no respect of the world. One minute you can be in the furthest northern reaches of the map and in an instant back in the central city hub. There is no cause for concern or sense of wonderment that used to occur in earlier games of the genre and something is ultimately lost here. To conclude, the game worlds of newer games are infinitely busier, active, and, for the most part, entertaining, however; they simply do not feel like what they are- Worlds.


Player Character
My first ever online avatar was a weakling Paladin by the name of Riveer. During character creation I unknowingly channeled points into irrelevant stats making him the most underpowered and yet charismatic holy crusader you might ever meet. Possibly the greatest turn on and off of the MMORPG genre back in the day was the sheer depth of proceedings. Most games prompted the player to allocate skill points when rolling a character, and while this is fine for people in the know of such things, eight year olds who had dabbled with Baldur’s Gate however didn’t stand much chance. To roll a character in certain games required several trips to the WC with a hefty manual and steely determination. I certainly do not miss those days but it did necessitate fan sites such as EverLore which were filled with resources and maps, the like which simply have no purpose to exist anymore.

Depth aside, what older MMORPGs did do great is choice. Most games offered numerous classes and races to play around with and there seemed to be an infinite amount of starting areas and paths. Games such as Ultima mastered the art of customization and unique playing experiences and as such, I cannot help but feel a little underwhelmed at newer games five or so options. The whole ethos of the older generation of the genre was “bigger is better” and this is something that has unfortunately been side-stepped of present. While certain classes were pointless and there was something enchanting about rolling something completely new every time. Great for choice, but depending on whether depth is your thing or not, it could be a little daunting to the new comer. 9/10

Whatever happened to the Ogre as a playable race? That’s what I want to know. In this day and age, developers seem obsessed with Orcs and Elves and to be quite frank, I miss the weirder creations. The player character element of the newer generation of games is all a bit well, samey. Most games offer a limited amount of classes and races in the name of “refinement’ and when they don’t, like Warhammer Online, it just all feels a little wrong. While a negative for previous games was the sheer depth to character creation, newer games have seemingly gone the other way making it so easy to roll a character that a baby jabbing at a keyboard could do it.

With the negatives aside however, the best thing about the newer generation of MMORPG’s is the sheer customization to each class. Most games operate a system of umbrella roles which then can be specialized into certain paths. This leads to a great deal of depth later on in the game and goes some way to make up for the lack of choices earlier on. Most games now also come with fully fleshed out factions (DAOC pioneered this but EQ also had a very tame version too) but to be quite honest, nobody has moved this forward enough for anyone to really get excited about it anymore. In short, the lack of choice fails to inspire any excitement but the “refinement” works and every class is worthwhile and needed, however, it’s just all a little too alike. 7/10

Newbie Experience

Let’s face it, nostalgic or not, being a newbie in an older MMORPG was not so much an experience and rather an ordeal. Games would drop you into the world and simply expect you to get on with it. Ultima Online would reduce players to cutting down small woodland areas for weeks on end, EverQuest would see you slaying snakes outside city gates and Dark Age of Camelot would have players gallivanting around on a hillside. The newbie experience of these games was an exercise in tough love, only the strong would remain to brave the rest of the harrowing difficulty that lay ahead. There was an alarming lack of tutorials, no simple and easy little quests to lure the player into crafting and other such activities- just a rusty sword and a rampant rodent problem.

Are there any positives to take from the older generations approach to newbies? Well it could be argued that simply throwing a player in the deep end was more immersive and the player was challenged to learn and grapple with the game. Without hand guiding quests the only hint of a tutorial was from other players who were kindly enough to help out; even though this did once lead me into the deadly catacombs of Qeynos- my body was never recovered. While it did force more interaction and a sense of accomplishment, In short, the newbie experience of older MMORPG’s was terrible at best. Dark Age of Camelot deserves a more notable mention for trying to implement a quest system but to be frank it was horrible whichever way you try to rationalize it. 3/10

Apparently welcoming new players into your game with open arms and helpful tutorials is a good thing. Since around 2004 with games such as EverQuest 2, Ryzom and World of Warcraft, the tutorial zone has become an art form. Quests perfectly guide players into experience and go great lengths in initiating new comers into the mechanics of the game. Also players can get a greater grasp of their class in the first ten levels which means that hours don’t have to be spent trying to find out whether or not the role of Druid is really for you.

In all regards, the newer generation of MMORPG’s takes top marks for its newbie experience. It is exemplary and continues to get better. Snakes at the city gates are totally a thing of the past. 10/10

http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/loadFeature/4554/page/1


In the second part of his Fighting Talk column, MMORPG.com writer Adam Tingle continues the battle between old and new MMORPGs. As it stands at the moment, new MMOs are narrowly edging out old MMOs by a score of 23 to 21. See if the oldsters can make a comeback in the areas of soloing, instances, and community in Old vs New MMOs Part 2.

Current Score: New MMOs 23 - Old MMOs 21

Try to be best 'cause you're only a man and a man's gotta learn to take it. Try to believe when the going gets rough that you gotta’ hang tough to make it. History repeats itself try and you'll succeed. Never doubt that you’re the one and you can have your dream. You’re the best around! Nothing is gonna’ ever keep you down! You're the best around! Nothing is gonna’ ever keep you down! You're the best around! Nothing is gonna’ ever keep you dow-ow-ow-ow-own!

General Article By Adam Tingle on September 20, 2010

Current Score: New MMOs 23 - Old MMOs 21

Try to be best 'cause you're only a man and a man's gotta learn to take it. Try to believe when the going gets rough that you gotta’ hang tough to make it. History repeats itself try and you'll succeed. Never doubt that you’re the one and you can have your dream. You’re the best around! Nothing is gonna’ ever keep you down! You're the best around! Nothing is gonna’ ever keep you down! You're the best around! Nothing is gonna’ ever keep you dow-ow-ow-ow-own!
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This week we jump straight back into the four-part Battle Royale that has sent shock waves through online forum communities everywhere. After Part I, at the break, new MMORPG’s were leading by a slender lead; can they maintain their momentum? Will the golden oldies of the genre hit back with false tooth and cane? Like always, grab your buttocks with reckless abandon, grab a hard drink, and prepare for the linguistic slaughter that is about to unfold. Let’s Get Ready To Ruuuuuuuuuumble (Again)

Solo Experience

The rain beats hard upon my back, the sun disappeared hours ago. My only lifeline for survival is the illuminated Moonstone in my backpack and the sword I wield by side. I have been wandering the countryside for hours upon hours, like Duran Duran I am “Hungry like the wolf” and ironically in search of wolves. To gain level 22 it seems that I have two choices: find companions and slay goblins in a basement, or alternatively brave the wilderness in search for green, blue and yellow considered wolves.

Solo playing in older MMORPG’s was all about one thing: grind. Whether it was Asheron’s Call, Anarchy Online or EverQuest, chances were, if nobody was about, you would take yourself to a suitable zone and abuse the local wildlife. Of course games such as Dark Age of Camelot did bring a quest system about in the form of “kill x of y” but ultimately there wasn’t much to proceedings. Although soloing was incredibly one dimensional, the upside to all this was an incredible sense of immersion (the buzzword of the article) when venturing forth on your own. Nothing comes quite as close to hunting in deserted zones and feeling real terror as the sun set and my monitor’s incapability’s to handle gamma set the screen to almost pitch black.

Of course newer generation games are simply better at solo playing but there was a great sense of independence and involvement in your character. While it can seem a tad nostalgic, there is something almost magical that has been lost to quest funneling and a universal progression shared by all characters. By today’s standards, setting out into a zone and engaging in wild life genocide is archaic, however, there was something generally exciting and terrifying about playing alone.7/10

Sadly as the genre has progressed, solo play is ultimately the fabric that makes up any MMORPG these days. During my time in WoW and AoC my only human interactions where in the form of duel requests and in the latter, rampant player killers hunting me down like a prize antelope. While I can moan and berate the fact that newer MMORPG’s seem to almost encourage solo play; I can gush and brim with praise at gameplay on offer to the lone traveler.

Possibly the greatest advancement in the modern MMORPG is that of solo adventuring. Players are now given a multitude of ways to level and gain experience and all of this makes for an entertaining and accessible game. Quests, which originated from earlier games, have finally advanced to the point of genre staple and now it would seem almost barbaric to set out into the wild without an objective at hand. Other advancements such as EverQuest 2’s achievements and Lord of the Rings Online’s deeds also add another dimension to proceedings. Rather than simply travelling towards the cap, players now can advance in different ways and this makes for engaging and multi-faceted gaming. In all, developers know how to keep the player busy.

Is there a criticism of solo playing within new games? Well it could be argued that while it has progressed leaps and bounds since the mid 2000s, it hasn’t really gone any further, yet. Newer games such as Age of Conan and Aion simply copy-and-paste the systems already in place and now questing simply feels like grind did way back when. With upcoming titles such as The Old Republic promising to deliver fresher experiences, this may well change in the coming years- as it stands now however, everything is just a little too familiar. 8/10

Dungeon Crawls & Instances

Train!” would sound out into an over-crowded dungeon. Immediately everyone with any sense would duck and cover and those unfortunate enough to be caught unawares- they were already dead. Dungeons in MMORPGs of yore were hotbeds of death, terror, and feverish excitement. The best way to describe places such as Blackburrow would be akin to a copper mine: the constant threat of death and the unstable behavior of mobs would see everyone clearing out periodically until the atmosphere was safe once again. Am I sexing the descriptions up in the name of nostalgia? I don’t think so.

Back in the old days, to die in an MMORPG was not just a jolly trip to a spirit healer; it was like opening a whole can of excrement covered worms. To enter a dungeon meant preparation and maturity. Everyone involved was drilled with almost military discipline. Before even thinking about entering somewhere, bind points were made, rations were stored, and maps were printed from fan sites. One slip up could spell a five hour naked corpse run and many angry interactions with people who were once your friend. Was such fear inducing adventure fun? Well yes it was and the immersion of it all was simply magical. How many of us tell tales of late night dungeon crawls from games a decade old compared to those who tell of how things got a bit hairy in Great Barrows?

The design of dungeons, while not perfect, summed up a kind of D&D influence. There was no apparent point to venturing into these places just a desire for loot, experience and exploration. One of the greatest things about old MMORPGs was the fact that nothing really had purpose; dungeons were simply there because development deemed it necessary for its virtual world. One day you could explore a dungeon with five groups already ahead of you and the next you could be on an excursion into some dark catacomb that had not been touched since launch. While they were not perfect and their design now is archaic, there was something intrinsically entertaining and immersive about the whole experience. As for the matter of instances, these didn’t really come into use until games such as Anarchy Online introduced their mission system and to be quite honest, I long to go through another dungeon to find our target camped by another group- annoying yes, entertaining and memorable? Certainly. 9/10

While I do not want to sound overly negative and like an old man wishing of past times, the newer dungeon design of modern MMORPGs just reflects the whole game. The word is “refinement” therefore gone are the pointless dead ends and rare spawns; gone are the unused and purposeless dungeons. Everything in the modern genre has an almost clinical purpose; quests are introduced as a reason to venture into such places and achievements are handed out when finished. Is this a bad thing? Not entirely, it makes for a perfect game, however, the ultra-geek within me screams for more than a game…

The dungeons and instances within newer games, it must be said, are a varied bunch. Most games sadly subscribe to Blizzard’s ethos of small linear, Disney theme dungeons. While there is nothing apparently wrong with this approach, it just saps some of the immersion and general feel. While older games delivered true excitement in their dungeons, newer games simply make it feel like some sort of mini-game. There is a definite beginning, middle and end to all of these places whereas older games simply ended when you felt you could take no more. Of course I may be sugaring the pill of older games but the whole genre seems to have taken fully to Blizzards styles and directions, as such everything is just too much of the same.

Of course there are some glimmers of hope; Vanguard and EverQuest 2 deliver massive dungeons that don’t necessarily have need for quests. And while linear is at the core of proceedings, the dungeons are still fun. I feel that I will be fighting a never ending battle between love and hate for accessibility. In earlier MMORPGs it was tough to get into dungeon crawling; you had to meet the right people and be inducted into the experience. It is not bad thing that instances are easily accessible by the click of a button and there are no mammoth texts to read before you actually know your role. Overall instances and dungeons in newer games are fun; however, they just lack that excitement and depth given to them earlier in the genre. I can’t help but think howeber, that through “refinement” and a crusade of accessibility, the genre has lost something more intelligent and immersive. 6/10

Community

“A friend made in Guk is a friend for life” no truer words were spoken. Back in the olden days, we didn’t have Auction Houses, fancy LFG panels, and Facebook add-ons, we had organic communities that flourished and grew in the gaps that the developers left behind. Socializing within MMORPGs was as much a part of the gameplay as combat or crafting was, to experience most of the game you had to bunch together with others and as such, the genre just seemed a far friendlier place.

While in recent years developers have advanced such mechanics as group finding and trading, something has again been lost. I am not going to be a snob and say that people these days are generally immature, but, communities way back when were more like Vietnam Veterans than game players. The rigors and trials you were put through to try and enjoy the game generally produced a different climate of person, sure there were assholes but there wasn’t really anybody within the games that just loved jumping about and screaming expletives every four seconds.

Like most old curmudgeons I truly long for the camaraderie of earlier games. Such places as the East Commons Bazaar in EverQuest were a magnificent sight. It was a fully player run market that consisted of hundreds of players and a hole in the wall. Was it perfect? Certainly not, but was it immersive and magical to the newcomer? Absolutely. Developers these days go a little too far in making their games accessible to all and while this is fine, I wouldn’t expect any other genre developer to make their game easier and less in-depth all in the sake of including everyone.

It’s easy to say that older generation MMORPGs had a better class of people but the general depth of the MMORPG genre did attract a more mature audience. I still keep in touch with certain players I met while adventuring throughout Norrath and the communities are revered in memory for a reason. 10/10

We could stereotype and say that all new MMORPGs contain communities full of sugar injected, Chuck Norris joke vomiting youths. Possibly in some cases you would be right; however, there are still some fine communities littered around the landscape. Generally socializing is not as forced anymore so finding friendship can be tough. My travels through new games I have to say are very lonely affairs- and this is not because it’s any harder to forge companions, it’s just that many people play with RL friends or simply see no need in interacting in a multiplayer game.

As mentioned above, I feel that the demise of the importance of community is due to developer interference. There seems to be a general direction from the developer that feels that accessibility and refinement is the way forward. A player run market and group system is simply not efficient enough, which it probably isn’t, but once this disappears the game becomes more solo centric than it really should. I suppose the general argument here is one of Sandbox vs. Theme Park and that the genre has tended to direct itself more towards the latter. While Auction Houses and other such bells and whistles are not a bad thing, they are detrimental to building a community.

Like I said previously however, there are some great communities still out there. If you wish to socialize then guilds are the way to go and games such as EVE Online are really keeping the old-school spirit alive. In short, MMORPGs have become a lot less player driven which is a shame; however, it’s not totally broken yet. 5/10

And that is time once more. Old MMORPGs are gaining momentum and finish this round as the winners at 47-42. Join me next week as I continue to moan, groan, and berate that fact that it is 2010 rather than 2001.

http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/loadFeature/4569/page/1

Fighting Talk: Old vs New MMOs Part 3
In Part I and Part II of Adam Tingle's Fighting Talk: Old vs New MMOs, "experienced" games were pitted against "the new kids on the block" in categories including community, solo play, instances and more. In today's installment of the three-part look at Old vs New MMOs, Adam discusses Guilds, Crafting and the Time Sink factor. See which group comes out victorious (for today)! Let us know your thoughts, as always, on the forums!

Fight, fight, fight! The lines have been drawn, the crowds have gathered, and the storm clouds are brewing. The next 2,000 words will be nothing but balls-to-the-wall action, linguistic explosions, and bone crunching metaphors. It’s Clash of the Titans, Big Trouble in Little MMORPG, and Close Encounters of the MMORPG kind. Think you can handle it?


Welcome back to part three of Old vs. New MMORPGs. By now you should be firmly sitting inside a camp of opinion and chanting for your champion. Who will emerge victorious? Who will be named winner? Well I don’t know, this isn’t part four yet, you’re such a pushy reader you know that? All that is left to say is: Let’s Get Ready To Rummmbbbllle! (for the third time)

Guilds


Back in the day, guilds were all important. If you wanted to understand the game as a newbie, progress through the trials as a mid-level character, or experience end-game content, guilds were your best shot. While today their use is still valuable, guilds were seemingly a lot more tight-knit in the past. Players came together through necessity to brave the games challenges, but also friendships blossomed.

My first serious guild in EverQuest, by the name of “The Silent Watch” contained players which I stayed in contact with for many years. Guilds were like a band of brothers: those who were involved were trustworthy and mature. One day you could shoot the breeze together and another depend on them to help you through a tricky situation or watch your back in a dungeon. Oh sure there was back biting, the odd moron, and some crap guilds out there even then, but this was the minority rather than the majority. At essence, guilds were all player driven, there were very few systems such as Guild Halls or levels but it outlined the difference between games now and then. To make a guild work it required real determination, a dedicated leader, and a desire for success.

Of course there is a hint of nostalgia and experience to this but many people remember their old school guilds fondly. For instance, my first attempt at finding a guild ended with a slightly insane role-player taking lead and disbanding the organization because we were “Dark Elf scumbags”. Of course there were the bad elements, it was hard to organize due to a lack of in-game tools, most required serious commitment, and it was a little primitive by today’s standards. With that said however, there was something great and friendly to find within guilds of yesterday. The necessity of others is something I sorely miss and grief for in modern MMORPGs. 8/10

Again, I do not wish to sound biased or negative, but, my experiences of guilds in newer MMORPGs haven’t been great. The biggest pursuit of said organizations, in any game, is seemingly to recruit as many people as possible. Almost absurdly in a game such as WoW I would apparently be in guild of 500 and nobody even made a single utterance in the guild channel. Such are the mechanics of today’s genre, socializing is not needed and not at all encouraged.

While most guilds I have ever been in have been rubbish, there are some great in-game tools to help anyone who wishes to form their own guild. Take for instance the formation of a guild, way back when you had to stand in a circle chanting chapters of “The Silmarillion” backwards to create one (I jest) but now it ranges from simple charters to a few people gathering at an NPC. Also organizations has never been easier with: in-game mail systems, bank systems, chat channels, message of days icons, in-game guild forums, websites and the list is endless. It seems almost absurd that being in a guild is now so easy but yet neglected. Perhaps this accessibility and help is part of the reason it is so underutilized?

Of course not every game is bad. Games such as Eve Online (which I count as post 2004, even though I know its release date) positively flourish when engaging in corporation activity. And I am aware that many people have carried on old guilds from older games, therefore not everyone shares my views. I just feel that the short-comings of community in newer games reflect disastrously in guild culture. MMORPGs such as EverQuest 2, Vanguard and Lord of the Rings Online aren’t entirely bad, but guilds just seem pointless unless you wish to spend all of your time on 25 man raids and gearing up: what happened to simply banding together with friends for the common purpose of camaraderie and adventure? 4/10

Difficulty/Time Sink Factor

On a weekly basis I bubble and froth with anger and annoyance. The reason for such negative behavior? Friends and peers who proudly boast about level 500, epic clad and super-mega-wow-crap-yourself-aren’t-I-a-great-big-raiding-bastard characters. Weekly I will berate anyone who dare tell me about their trips to the level cap; did they not play EverQuest, Ultima Online or Asheron’s Call? Do they realize that their jaunt to the level cap, and it was a jaunt, was nothing more than cowardly bottom burp in comparison to the epic, sprawling adventure that older games entailed? I spent 75 whole days in Norrath attempting to reach the level cap and do you know what? I never did.

Of course I am not about to say that the aforementioned is a good thing because it wasn’t. The common slogan of the new MMORPG player is “I want to play not work in an MMORPG” and this is fair enough. Nobody can fondly remember corpse runs and experience loss; nobody can fondly remember losing 75 days of your childhood in the name of a, quite frankly underachieving, Shaman. However, with all this said; the developers only had to tone down some of the harsher elements and not metaphorically wrap the game in bubble wrap and clear a nice primrose path to the level cap.

The difficulty of older MMORPGs was immense and to be honest I enjoyed it. I adored having to learn and wrestle with the game, I loved that not everyone got it, and I rejoiced that it took a long time to get to the level cap. For myself, the end game of an MMORPG is its worst feature; it is the point in which you realize your pursuit has been ultimately worthless. Oh sure you can busy yourself with all the activities such as raiding and PvP but what are trying to achieve now? To me the adventure is the aspiration to hit the top and as such I preferred when most games made it an almost impossible feat. There is a wonderful part of the film Wayne’s World (I know, I am that cultured) where Brian Doyle-Murray’s character, Noah Vanderhoff ,is discussing a videogame in which players pump endless money into to try and reach the next level which doesn’t exist. That is how MMORPGs are for me; their wonder is the journey and not the destination.

While I can fully appreciate progressive development and the toning down of certain elements- I long for a difficult MMORPG once more. Games such as EverQuest and Ultima Online were horrible, nasty and evil pieces of software but they were unimaginably brilliant at the same time. Sometimes when we take away the perceived worst part of something, we also take away something that was fundamental to it. 7/10

Accessibility and refinement: two words which in my view have stopped the genre being truly great. Newer games of the genre are fun for all the family, possibly we will see Wii-motion add-ons: Grandma and that kooky Aunt of yours, stepping up in the living room to play tennis with a goblin. People want to just have fun right? No working or any of that horrible grind required. Perhaps Age of Conan will introduce a dance-mat aspect to proceedings, to hit left simply “boogie on down” that way, to execute a special move, just “throw your hands up in the air like you just don’t care” as they say.

Of course I am being overly cynical; my opinions split and polarize in my own head in regards to difficulty within MMORPGs. On the one hand, I crave time stinks and difficulty, but as student type, I of course would. On the other hand however, I enjoy that I can play a spot of whatever online game without fear of losing a week’s worth of experience and a year’s worth of loot. The MMORPG genre pumps out outstandingly addictive videogames for a generation on the move and I am fine with this most of the time.

The journey to the level cap is now more varied and multi-faceted, other aspects of gameplay are emphasized rather than simply grind, and as a whole, the game is objectively a more entertaining experience. Developers have offered up ways of making their games playable to everyone and I cannot hold a grudge against that, I too enjoy that my dumbest of friends can now tag along in support.

But this slap-on-a-smile attitude of mine simply does not last for long. I can only ignore the sense of dissatisfaction for so long before it gnaws away at my very being. MMORPGs are intrinsically difficult, it is meant to be a grand and epic adventure. You wouldn’t play a BioWare RPG and be joyful that after two hours of story it had ended would you? For veterans who played the older games of the genre, there will always be an element of underwhelming disappointment that MMORPGs are now, at their core, about the end game.

In fairness, the end game of newer MMORPGs is entertaining and varied but honestly, what is the point? Why spend hours laboring away for the pursuit of gear when you know that the only result will be eventual boredom or an expansion which makes your efforts ultimately meaningless. Of course the discovery here is that all MMORPGs are ultimately pointless if one thinks that way but hey, let’s keep quiet about that. While I enjoy that the games are not as vindictive or evil, I do miss the challenge or older games more than I enjoy being handed the level cap on a plate. 4/10

Crafting

I am going to put my neck on the line here and be controversial and say: crafting in older games, for the most part, sucked the big one. Unless you were an Ultima Online player, crafting was a neglected commodity in many games, most items you could make were worthless and the greatest items in-game were found on rare spawns rather than master artisans.

The reason I hold such views is that crafting tended to be so ill explained. Apart from one or two dodgy guides on fan-sites, the games would give no help and more often than not crafting would be neglected and forgotten. While some will now be screaming with anger at my wrongness, in my opinion it was just plain bad in most games. However, with the above stated, older systems of crafting such as Ultima’s were actually more ambitious than newer games.

One of the best advancements of the genre is the ability to branch out more than simply combat and crafting is definitely one aspect that has been updated. While I feel older games systems lacked, they were not completely different or a million miles away and perhaps with better tutorials my views would be different. 5/10

Crafting in newer MMORPGs is a staple to gameplay. Whether you’re an Aion man, a World of Warcraft women or an Age of Conan hermaphrodite, chances are a quest has established your role as an artisan. Items that are crafting are now of better use and a lot of games do include fun systems and mini-games in which things are created. Who would have thought farming pipe weed would be so enjoyable?

Of course while some games really excel in this aspect, most games suffer from a copy-and-paste approach which unfortunately stems from that elephant in the room, World of Warcraft. Blizzard’s game has the most unimaginative, uninvolving, and boring crafting system available that it is hard to see why so many games go in this way. While some stand out, some are just plain old boring I suppose.

While I enjoy a spot of crafting in newer games, I do feel like it is still not as advanced or as ambitious as it should be. Everything in recent games is played very safe and I would like to see a developer take on an Ultima style system or perhaps incorporate something like A Tale in the Desert’s approach and create something truly immersive, unique, and interesting. In short: good, fun, and definitely better but still not quite as good as it should be after almost a decade. 8/10

And that is time once more! After an explosion round we see the respective MMORPG periods stumble back into their corners. As we reach the fourth and final part, the scores are 67-58 to old MMORPGs. Things are definitely hotting up and be sure not the miss the last part of this epic battle.

http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm/feature/4587/General-Fighting-Talk-Old-vs-New-MMOs-Part-IV.html

Fighting Talk: Old vs New MMOs Part IV
In Part I, Part II and Part III of Adam Tingle's Fighting Talk: Old vs New MMOs, "experienced" games were pitted against "the new kids on the block" in categories including community, solo play, instances and more. In today's installment of the four-part look at Old vs New MMOs, Adam discusses Fluff, PvP and the End Game. See which group finally comes out victorious Let us know your thoughts, as always, on the forums!

As Chesney Hawk once wailed, it's the final countdown. Once and for all we can as a community categorically state just which is better: old or new MMORPGs. Oh sure people may question your right to such a statement but do not worry, just tell them that Adam Tingle, High lord of MMORPG.com's Fighting Talk, told you so.

Hello and welcome back to the fourth and final edition of Fighting Talk: Old vs. New. I can already sense the feverish excitement about you all. Today we will discover once and for all just which generation of MMORPG is the best. I have nothing left to say except: good luck, god bless and let's get ready to ruuuuumble! for the last time.



Fluff

I seem to remember building a homely little log cabin in Ultima Online. Within my comfy abode was a bed, a couple of chairs and maybe one or two pieces of art adorning the walls - all built by my hand of course. Chopping wood for skill points was a lonely existence but coming home to this place, free of bears and wolves, well, it was virtual bliss until a Rogue type moved next door with a monstrosity of a two story building. My lawn was shot, my view was destroyed, and it took all my willpower not to go round and cause a scene with my neighbor. Eventually I moved on, sick of his constant expansions and loud parties. I never did find a better location for my log cabin.

Did older generation games do fluff better? One thing that I generally concede is that newer games seem to master the art of side distraction but in analysing and thinking back, older games were quite efficient in this area. I remember days spent fishing of Qeynos piers on the advice that a ruby may be caught. I remember spending hours decorating my instanced apartment in Anarchy Online. In essence, fluff in MMORPGs hasn't moved forward, only the way it is presented.

Like everything in older MMORPGs, immersion was prevalent. If you built a home in Ultima, everyone could see it; if you decided to craft a chair and place it against a nice river bed, well that was your choice. Fluff in earlier games wasn't simply to distract you from the toil to the level cap, it was to immerse you even more into the experience: This wasn't a game you were playing remember. This is a virtual, living world that you existed within.

While certain games such as EverQuest didn't do much in the way of side-distraction, it could be argued that players made their own fun. I remember players who would sell certain items setting up shops every week at a specific place and time. There was a sense of total immersion that instanced neighborhoods and appearance armor sets just do not capture. Perhaps I am a deluded nostalgic wreck but I can't help but feel that developers have destroyed player-driven immersion and such pursuits.

Older games also had different languages to learn and a multitude of pointless skills that could be achieved. I remember learning a great deal of Ogre just for the heck of it. When you think about it, it really puts to shame Blizzard's impenetrable Alliance/Horde language barrier. So was fluff in earlier games good and if not better than newer games? In my opinion it was at least the same if not a tad more ambitious with fully persistent player creations and the like. 8/10

Yet again we return to that old bittersweet friend of "accessibility". Fluff in newer games in introduced via quests, tips, advice, and any other way possible. I have to admire that everyone can enjoy the side-distractions introduced in newer games. However, it seems that it all just seems so pointless. Take for instance housing in Lord of the Rings Online. The game itself seems to lack any real need for housing so most of the time neighborhoods are empty. The way the genre has progressed, elements such as housing has seemingly become unnecessary and only attractive to the MMORPG equivalent of achievement junkies.

I think the major difference between fluff now and then is the overall immersive element to it. In older MMORPGs a house was built because it was a way of furthering your belief in the fantasy. These days it's just an extensive trophy collection. The whole argument really comes down to a sort of simulator vs. game argument. While newer MMORPGs are great games, they are essentially just games, there is no element of real depth or emulation of a virtual world and this in effect makes fluff in newer games ultimately meaningless.

Aside from my gripes with overall need for fluff in newer games, this element is well catered for. The list of possibilities is endless from NCSoft's player shops to Xbox Live inspired achievements in WoW. MMORPGs of recent days have oodles of fluff and side distractions to sate your appetites above and beyond grinding to the level cap.

The big question however, is thus: Is fluff better in newer or older games? Well I would have to go with the latter. While there are a myriad of things to do in newer games, it all just feels meaningless. Nothing really adds to the interest or immersion of your character; every side-distraction is now simply a mini-game akin to popping MMORPG bubble wrap. While there is definitely more of it, there isn't anything astonishingly different and definitely nothing as ambitious. 5/10


End Game


And so we get to my most hated element of the MMORPG genre. End Game in earlier MMORPGs was essentially at its core not much different to games now. Things were definitely harder to organize and execute. However, raiding in somewhere like the Planes of Fear was essentially similar to raiding in any dungeon in a newer MMORPG. The only real difference was that older games didn't really have the theme park linear path element to them. Players bunched together in regimented groups and the adventure that followed usually involved a dragon of some sort. Was it really so dissimilar?

There is a big issue of player retention these days and end game is all important, but I am firmly of the belief that this wasn't a massive issue back a few years ago. Of course it is important to note that I am not a hardcore end game raider so whatever I say could be complete hogwash. Back in the day it seemed to me that players were not hurtling towards the finish line or trying desperately to conquer the game. MMORPGs of the past were seemingly played on their own terms. There were no honor junkies or epic gear hoarders in the same manner of today. Gamers just seemingly wanted to experience the more stunning elements of the high-end of the game and this usually involved a constant stream of expansions and one or two dragons.

I could be completely wrong but I still believe there was a real element of exploration and immersion to everything. While WoW offers a small number of 25-man raids, games such as EverQuest and Anarchy Online offered hundreds similar experiences. One day you could enter a dungeon unknown to many and the next you could be in the bowels of a familiar place fighting a newly placed epic boss. There wasn't a sense that this was just the end of the game, players still carried on as they always had: Adventuring through the unknown. This was what the genre was about, exploration and immersion in a virtual world.

Of course this could all be blind nostalgia and the end game of the past was terrible but, in my opinion, this element of the game reflected the whole experience. It was immersive, it was adventurous and not at any point did it feel like an endless grind for more stats, more achievements, and more loot. 9/10

Something really irks me about newer MMORPGs end game. Perhaps it is the obsessive compulsive element of collecting and endlessly grinding or maybe it is just a sense of hate towards those who boast of 700 strength points and 25,000 DPS. Who knows? One thing is for sure, the end game of any MMORPG on the market currently is all important and ultimately game breaking.

More so than ever, end game is the be-all and end-all of the genre. The journey to the level cap is now but a minor footnote to the skirmishes, raids and whatever other pursuits are on offer at the highest level. Is this a good thing? Well for myself I find it a bore but for others this is the height of MMORPG gaming.

So obviously we have games such as World of Warcraft which offer raids for loot, boasting rights but also story if you are such inclined. Most games take WoW's approach and copy-and-paste wholesale, which is disappointing seeing how it isn't so different from earlier games. Turbine's Lord of the Rings Online has an interesting end game in that the title still hasn't reached the mid-point in the journey so most raids and other such activities are story driven. Another positive of this is that free expansions, known as Books, are available at regular intervals and this drives the end game away from being stale.

Ultimately the end game of newer MMORPGs just isn't that different from the older generation. Things are definitely more accessible, which is a positive in this regard, and you will not have to spend twelve hours to complete a 25-man raid. With all this said however, has the genre really progressed enough and captured not only the excitement of earlier games but also struck out in its own right? No, not really. Essentially this is the same old beast parading around in snazzy visuals and a better UI. 7/10

PVP

And finally the last category of this epic battle. Player versus player divides audiences of the genre. You either love the excitement of invisible dice roll battles or hate it. PvP in earlier games was something quite under-developed for the most part. However, one game stood alone and towered above the rest, and ultimately still does. That game was...Hello Kitty Island Adventure.

Just a bit of last category humour for you there. Of course I am talking about the Goliath that was and still is Dark Age of Camelot. DAoC is a game so brilliantly addictive and excellent that thousands of war mongering Athurites take the battlegrounds and bludgeon, stab and magic one another to death. For many this game still hasn't been topped in terms of PvP and for the most part I would agree.

The only problem with most older MMORPGs was that most of their PvP systems were not developed enough. EverQuest, for instance, had a number of factional wars but its PvP didn't extend much further than arena battles and the odd active PvP server. With that said however, Eve Online offers the greatest PvP this side of a galaxy, far, far, away. My thoughts are divided on whether the latter game is pre 2003 or post. While it was released in 2003 it is definitely part of the high profile MMORPGs of today and I do seem to remember its reception was horrible to begin with and it has spent the best part of seven years continually improving. The jury is still out on that one.

To conclude, most PvP in older games wasn't all that great, however, Dark Age of Camelot is one of the great PvP centric games ever conceived. For the sake of one, groundbreaking game, older MMORPGs hold their own in PvP stakes. 8/10

MMORPG players of present are constantly urged to engage in virtual battle with others. From the charmingly humorous lands of Azeroth to the sexually ambiguous plains of Atreia, PvP is important to any game of the genre. Players are eased into the experience via quests and even rewarded via points and other such systems. This element of game play has never been so popular and widely used, however, is it better than games of a decade past?

I think the answer would be a half-hearted "I suppose so" followed by a mumble and a shuffle of the feet. It's not that recent games are rubbish at this aspect; it's that it simply isn't as good as it should be. Dark Age of Camelot set out its brutal roots almost ten years ago and nothing really has beaten it into submission yet. Warhammer Online surely has its moments but for the time that has elapsed since the aforementioned game, it's just not good enough.

With that being said, newer games such as WoW have really brought the experience to the mainstream so that now you can boast to school friends and work colleagues about how you "kicked their bitch-ass" the previous night without feeling like a sociopath. I for one enjoy the accessibility that developers have brought to this element (which is ironic as I rage against this for the most part).

In short, PvP in newer games is good, no scratch that, it's great, but, it's probably only on a par with the lands of Camelot. With a little more ambition and bravery from developers, we could see something really special with the slight advancements made in this area. However, as it stands, it's not that different from Mythic's classic. 8/10

And finally, we can now all relax. Punches have been traded, blood has been shed, and answers have been sought. I can finally announce which generation of MMORPG is better. It is time to go over to the judges. Old MMORPGs 92 - 78 New MMORPGs!

So there we have it, the older generation is the victor by a fourteen point margin. Surprised? Angry? Elated? Whatever the emotion running through your brain box, rest assured, you can vent them all in the forums below.

It is important to note that these articles are simply my opinions and thoughts. I do not expect anyone to totally agree and I actually enjoy hearing other people's views and thoughts on the genre. As we are all here in mutual love and adoration of this genre, I like the fact that we all enjoy these games in different ways. For myself, immersion is key. I revelled in the virtual world created in earlier games and see the accessibility and overall gameness of newer MMORPGs to be a betrayal of the genres roots. However, I am willing to accept that people think different and for that, I salute your opinions entirely. Nothing is left for me to say but thank you for time, perseverance, and soon-to-come insults/praise.

reserved

Tim uses Wall of Text.

It's Super Effective.

Tim types like he talks.....

nonstop.

SneakyJes wrote:Tim types like he talks.....

nonstop.

lol Good Shit....

Omg Tim, I'm interested but really, TL:DR!

Time for you to start a podcast IMO.

Ohh nice, great read.
I completely agree with whats written in this great wall of text.
Wish nowaday mmo companies could merge good qualities from new&old mmos.

if its a red vs blue thing, ill side with the blue side. if not then i concur!

Rofl, i did not type this >.> I copy pasted.

this post crit me for over 9000

Dox wrote:Ohh nice, great read.
I completely agree with whats written in this great wall of text.
Wish nowaday mmo companies could merge good qualities from new&old mmos.

This lol.